The Oldsmobile Connection

[88 Coupe]

Hello everyone,

Got an informative PM from a TOC member regarding this thread. A little constructive criticism, some information about smilies, and some sincere advice on how to compose my messages in a more clear and concise manner.

It got me wondering if anyone else might have any comments. To get the ball rolling, I’ll throw out a few of my own:

1) Just because you’ve heard a piece of information all your life, doesn’t mean it’s not a myth.
2) If you do not want anyone to comment on one your statements, do not post it.
3) If you are not prepared to defend it, do not post it.
4) Before you respond to a post, read what is there, not what you think is there.
5) If you are not sure what is there, ask for clarification before you reply.
6) If someone asks you for clarification, do the best you can to give it to them.
7) If someone disagrees with, or questions, your statement, do not consider it a personal attack.
8) Keep an open mind.

Only one rule applies:

9) If you think I am wrong, take the time and compose a reply, complete with quotes. Show me where you have been attacked first, and explain your position clearly. Refrain from interjecting any loaded statements. Use spell-check, capital letters, and punctuation. That is how an efficient discussion works.

I’m more interested in negative comments, as “preaching to the choir” is not productive in a discussion group. To those members who might want to do a search on “88 Coupe” and go from there. Good luck.

EDIT: Replaced the wording in #9 with a clearer statement I stole from andrewk.

Regards, Norm

[andrewk]

88 Coupe wrote: Hello everyone,

Got an informative PM from a TOC member regarding this thread. A little constructive criticism, some information about smilies, and some sincere advice on how to compose my messages in a more clear and concise manner.

It got me wondering if anyone else might have any comments. To get the ball rolling, I’ll throw out a few of my own:

1) Just because you’ve heard a piece of information all your life, doesn’t mean it’s not a myth.
2) If you do not want anyone to comment on one your statements, do not post it.
3) If you are not prepared to defend it, do not post it.
4) Before you respond to a post, read what is there, not what you think is there.
5) If you are not sure what is there, ask for clarification before you reply.
6) If someone asks you for clarification, do the best you can to give it to them.
7) If someone disagrees with, or questions, your statement, do not consider it a personal attack.
8) Keep an open mind.

Only one rule applies:

9) Quote the statement you have a problem with, and state your objection to it.

I’m more interested in negative comments, as “preaching to the choir” is not productive in a discussion group. To those members who might want to do a search on “88 Coupe” and go from there. Good luck.

Regards, Norm

Thanks for posting this Norm. I feel that some members here are too thin skinned, that just because someone doesnt agree with them, that it is condecending and an insult. Just because you (or anyone) call them out on the carpet doesnt mean that you hate them, or are out to get them. In my experience, you look to find the answer, and the truth. Both are commendable.

I too like to find the truth about a statement, like whether or not it is true and why or why not. I always try to read what is there, with no predispostion of what the 'tone' is. Words or phrases mean different things in different parts of the countries. Dont try to read what isnt there. If the author intended for an emphasis, he/she would use italics or bold type. Or smilies. Its as simple as that.

Andrew

[88delta88]

88 Coupe wrote: some information about smilies

I saw no information on smilies :-)

[88 Coupe]

88delta88 wrote: ........ I saw no information on smilies
Quoted from my response to the subject PM.

88 Coupe wrote: Quote: ........ The disadvantage of using these forums is that emoticons are not enough to prevent misinterpretation of the emotional meaning behind what is written ........
That’s why I don’t use them.

Quote: ........ It takes deliberate attention to every detail of careful phrasing to prevent misinterpretation.
That’s why my posts are so precisely worded.

[88delta88]

gotcha!

[88 Coupe]

I was looking for a way to incorporate a more recent post into this Thread, when I noticed one I should have responded to at the time.

andrewk wrote: ........ If the author intended for an emphasis, he/she would use italics or bold type. Or smilies ........
In a book or webpage form, or anywhere there is no dialog, I agree. In a discussion/forum atmosphere, I disagree.

In this environment they are often used to twist facts to fit ones agenda. A familiar example, can be found here in the thirteenth post:
Hans wrote: intense-racing.com wrote: The 1.90:1 INTENSEâ„¢ Full Roller Rocker Arms are a complete bolt-on kit that should increase top end power by at least 20 to 25 wheel horsepower on a supercharged vehicle and 10-15 wheel horsepower on a naturally aspirated vehicle - depending on what other modifications have been performed. Click here for our first dyno session with Third Gen's showing a net gain of 23 wheel horsepower (29 crank horsepower) with NO OTHER CHANGES on a mildly modded Bonneville SSEi ........
In this case, the use of bold and cap fonts were used (along with a small ommision) to divert all attention from the fact that the quote referred to a different product and application, and had nothing to do with the topic. The purpose was, to imply that the product could actually show the same power gain, when in fact, no power gain has ever been documented in the original context of that thread.

The Q & A format used here, eliminates the need for anything other than words and simple punctuation.

Norm

[88 Coupe]

Hey Mods,

Another thread I couldn't find, cause it's in the wrong category. The ****** that started, it must have had a ****** in his ******.

When one of you gets time, please move it over to its proper section.

Norm

[andrewk]

Now moved to the off topic lounge...

Andrew

[88 Coupe]

Everyone: This is a continuation of the attempted hijack/ flame war, that was started here.

87Delta wrote: 88 Coupe wrote: If you have any problems with my posts, read this, then post your comments there, instead of hijacking this thread.
Like it isn't as bad as half the threads you manage to turn into a debacle ........
If you'd like to point out any examples, post the quotes, and state your objections. It's why I started this thread.

87Delta wrote: ........ with long ass reads of you always trying to prove you're right? Hah, right ........
It has been stated, numerous times, that my long ass reads are for clarity. I am confident enough in my manhood, and mature enough, that I do not see a need to prove anything to anyone.

Any time I post anything that you know to be incorrect, I expect you, or anyone else, to make me aware of my error. It seems there are some who take offense when I extend the same courtesy. Then, when they are not capable of rationally defending their false statements, and/or cannot answer simple questions, they resort to using flames and insults. I just go along for the ride.

Sound familiar?

We can start with the following.
88 Coupe wrote: 87Delta wrote: ........ you may want to replace the thermostat ........
Nothing, so far, points to a faulty thermostat. The fact that it "fixed itself", tends eliminate it as the culprit.

Most factory stats are capable of outlasting the car they came in, yet they are the first component to get the blame for any heating problem.
Is the statement not factual? If not, what is wrong with it?

87Delta wrote: And don't apologize for my actions, mind your own damn business.
I will post anything I feel is appropriate. I did notice, you did not dispute the part about your immaturity.

87Delta wrote: ........ Not everyone is "the oh mighty one" with knowledge like you appear to be ........
Now, tell us all, how that statement is not my own damn business.

You have the floor. Shoot your best shot.

Norm

[88 Coupe]

Ilovemy98:

I appreceate your input, although the reason I posted the first link, was to move any subsequent comments, involving the hijack, here.

Quote: ........ Everybody's style is a little different ........
Mine, to the best of my ability, is to make sure everyone gets the most accurate information possible. To that end, I do not post (except to ask questions) in areas where I am not knowledgeable and I expect the same behavior from everyone else.

There are always that few, who will attack the messenger, in a futile attempt to change the message. I hope to deal with them here.

The attempt to move the flames here, was to promote better communications. In theory, when the link was posted, the flamer would move here, and the trashing of a good discussion would stop. Maybe it will work next time.

Quote: ........ And can someone please explain to me why Norm can't give advice without somebody feeling like they are being attacked? ........
That is my purpose here. To find that answer without trashing anyone else's thread.

Quote: ........ just calling it how I see it ........
As, I believe, everyone should. A$$ kissing, along with "political correctness", are impediments to accurate communication. The opposite is true of open discussion.

Norm

[Ilovemy98]

Oops, kinda missed the boat on that link... and I may have missed the instructions on this... but how do you make the quoting work? I'd like to be able to use it, but I never get it to work properly. Thanks for the help!
-Carl

[73Delta88]

Ilovemy98 wrote: Oops, kinda missed the boat on that link... and I may have missed the instructions on this... but how do you make the quoting work? I'd like to be able to use it, but I never get it to work properly. Thanks for the help!
-Carl
http://www.oldsconnection.com/forum/faq.php?mode=bbcode#4

[Ilovemy98]

Thanks!

[88 Coupe]

Hi all,

Following, is a PM I received yesterday afternoon. I believe it to be self-explanatory.

Erroneous Restrictionism! wrote: From: ahondadriversnightmare
To: 88 Coupe
Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 1:01 pm
Subject: !

I'm sending this as a PM only because it has no relevance to the intended topic. I dont which to start a new thread regarding this, it is intended for you with one opinion, not many.

Can I imply that we have a different learning on knowledge?
Was i acting too parochial?

I knew that if I had answered the question the first time this may have ended quite quickly.

I was wrong for letting frustration get in front of my knowledge. However I do understand the reasons behind your questioning!

I admire your Socrates approach!
You have gained your credibility by producing the correct facts, which eventually creates a "natural trust" from others. Eg: Someone makes a claim, you cry BS even though you may not know the facts, they either admit it's bogus because of your credibility or they call you on it. It's clever in the most simplest terms. Am I wrong?

And the following, was my reply:

88 Coupe wrote: To: ahondadriversnightmare
Posted: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:37 pm
Subject: Re: !

ahondadriversnightmare wrote: I'm sending this as a PM only because it has no relevance to the intended topic ........
A thread has already been started on the subject.

http://www.oldsconnection.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2230


I waited 24 hours after he read my reply, before posting it. I'll wait another day, before I answer this one.
Regards, Norm

[88 Coupe]

OK.

Funny thing happened after I broke it down, to isolate the points I would answer.

I discovered, he did not say, or ask, anything that makes any sense.

I think, after reading it, any rational person would think he was on glue.

Regards, Norm