The Oldsmobile Connection

[MantiZ68]

I'm working on my 4dr Cutlass Supreme i've replaced the rear shocks and springs and i'm curently replacing the whole front suspension and steering parts. Just waiting for bolts for my control arms. I'm wondering what would be the best setup for my front end. I'm just driving it around town, but i want it to corner well. I tried searching this site and the net and didn't really come up with alot. I'm thinking this;
Camber -1/2
Caster 0- -1/2
Toe In 1/16
I'm think 0 - negative caster so it the car leans into the turn instead of out. Everthing up front is stock(control arms spindles, ect.). Any ideas or setups that work for you guys could you let me know.....thanx :)

[88 Coupe]

Hi MantiZ68,

Welcome to TOC.

Quote: ........ I'm thinking this;
Camber -1/2
Caster 0- -1/2
Toe In 1/16 ........
How did you arrive at these numbers?

Quote: ........ I'm think 0 - negative caster so it the car leans into the turn instead of out ........
How will it do that?

Norm

[MantiZ68]

With Positive caster if you notice when you turn the wheels to the right, lets say, you will notice that the right front of your car will lift and the left of your car will drop. So with negative caster the opposite is true. Mind you, you do lose a little drivability because of your wheels wanting to track the opposite way. The angles i came up with just from searching the net and reading some articles in hot rodding magazines. I have worked on a friends pit crew for circle track racing, but that's a different beast altogether. I figured negative camber for better a better footprint around corners and the negative caster to help as well. Just wondering what people are running to get the best performance at a budget. :)

[MantiZ68]

OK i did a search on the net for caster and came across this article about running more positive caster do to camber gain when cornering. So now I'm confused :shock: LOL!!! Any ideas or should i just get my alignment with stock specs?

[88 Coupe]

MantiZ68 wrote: With Positive caster if you notice when you turn the wheels to the right, lets say, you will notice that the right front of your car will lift and the left of your car will drop ........
Did you stop to ask yourself; "what caused this to happen?"?

Quote: ........ you do lose a little drivability ........
Major loss of control, would be a more accurate description.

Quote: ........ because of your wheels wanting to track the opposite way ........
Minus ½° on a G body will make it impossible for them to track at all.

Quote: ........ The angles i came up with just from searching the net ........
Any links?

Quote: ........ and reading some articles in hot rodding magazines ........
Articles in those magazines are not known for their accuracy, but I doubt any of them suggested the numbers you posted.

Quote: ........ I have worked on a friends pit crew for circle track racing ........
Since roundy cars only turn left, do not go straight, or turn right, they use more than excessive camber on the right side. How practical is that for street use?

How much caster did your friend take out of his car?

Quote: ........ wondering what people are running to get the best performance at a budget.
Depends how much "driveability" they are willing to give up.

MantiZ68 wrote: OK i did a search on the net for caster and came across this article about running more positive caster do to camber gain when cornering. So now I'm confused ........
Post the link.

Quote: ........ should i just get my alignment with stock specs?
Until you have a better understanding of front end geometry, use these:

Caster = +3½º
Camber = +½º
Toe in = ⅛"

Norm

[Brando]

I too would recommend setting it to stock specifications.



TOC Admin
Brando

[MantiZ68]

88 Coupe wrote: MantiZ68 wrote: With Positive caster if you notice when you turn the wheels to the right, lets say, you will notice that the right front of your car will lift and the left of your car will drop ........
Did you stop to ask yourself; "what caused this to happen?"?


Ya when i went to college our alignment teacher explained it to us and that's why i was wondering about the angles


Quote: ........ you do lose a little drivability ........
Major loss of control, would be a more accurate description.


I wouldn't say major loss of control we ran the race car with -1 caster on left wheel and +5 on the right and won a few races with that setup


Quote: ........ because of your wheels wanting to track the opposite way ........
Minus ½° on a G body will make it impossible for them to track at all.


you think? its only half a degree and there is negative camber and toe in


Quote: ........ The angles i came up with just from searching the net ........
Any links?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caster_angle
http://www.240edge.com/performance/tuning-caster.html
http://www.ozebiz.com.au/racetech/theory/align.html
I also found this cant remember the web site though

Caster Camber Toe Total
(deg) (deg) (in)
L R L R
Street +4 +4.5 -.5 -.5 3/32
Hard Street Use +5 +5.5 -1 -1 3/32
Drag Racing +4 +4 0 0 1/32
Road racing +6 +6 -1.75 -1.75 Short Course
1/8 out
Long Course
1/16 in




Well i came to this forum for a little help and some knowledge from those that could help or want to help. I did a little reading and found that you enjoy belittling people more than helping them out Norm, so this will be my last post here. Its been a few years since I've been interested in working on cars, I've been building them for 15 yrs now you get kind of sick of working on them after a while :D But my dad bought this car brand new in 1982 and he gave it to me just before he died. My mom wants me to junk it i would love to fix it up and pass it down to my son....sounds stupid i know but oh well. Anyway thanx for all you help going to go with these specs
Caster +5
Camber -1
Toe In 3/32
and I'll go from there. My buddy does alignments at the shop in town here so if it sucks I'll play with it till i like it. Peace out boys

P.S. Norm have another beer and chill out dude :lol:

[88 Coupe]

MantiZ68 wrote: ........ Well i came to this forum for a little help and some knowledge from those that could help or want to help ........
And you did not expect to find someone who actually wanted to discuss the subject.

MantiZ68 wrote: ........ I did a little reading and found that you enjoy belittling people more than helping them out ........
You did not find it out. You found out someone said it.

Too bad you do not understand the difference.

MantiZ68 wrote: ........ so this will be my last post here ........
Why am I not surprised?

Norm

[MantiZ68]

Discuss

American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source dis·cuss (dĭ-skŭs') Pronunciation Key
tr.v. dis·cussed, dis·cuss·ing, dis·cuss·es

1. To speak with another or others about; talk over.
2. To examine or consider (a subject) in speech or writing.

Belittle
WordNet - Cite This Source belittle

verb
1. cause to seem less serious; play down; "Don't belittle his influence" [syn: minimize]
2. express a negative opinion of; "She disparaged her student's efforts" [syn: disparage] [ant: blandish]
3. lessen the authority, dignity, or reputation of; "don't belittle your colleagues" [syn: diminish]
:rock:

[88 Coupe]

We were already aware of those definitions.

What is your point?