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88 Coupe
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 Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 4:03 pm |
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Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:25 am Posts: 3196 Images: 10 Location: Southern California
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GraveReaper0 wrote: ........ How hard would it be to get 350 horses out of an olds 350?
Simple answer for a simple question. 350 HP on an engine dyno would be a "piece of cake".
Now, I'll deviate from my normal policy, one time, and read (and answer) part of what is not there.
Since so many different spec combinations can be used to achieve that goal, and each will show different power/torque characteristics, the number is about as useful as the term "Rocket" when describing a "real world" engine.
Personally, I don't consider "bragging rights" or "advertising", part of the real world.
Norm.
Last edited by 88 Coupe on Sat Dec 09, 2006 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
_________________ Harry S. Truman wrote: When you have an efficient government, you have a dictatorship.
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88 Coupe
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 Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 5:55 pm |
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Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:25 am Posts: 3196 Images: 10 Location: Southern California
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I forgot to delete my previous post while I was editing it. I would have changed it accordingly, but, the editing mode does not show new posts.
Sorry for the confusion.
GraveReaper0 wrote: So you're saying its easy?
Very.
Norm
_________________ Harry S. Truman wrote: When you have an efficient government, you have a dictatorship.
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88 Coupe
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 Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 5:43 am |
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Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:25 am Posts: 3196 Images: 10 Location: Southern California
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88 Coupe wrote: GraveReaper0 wrote: ........ Coupe, do you know exactly what the differences are? ........ I will, as soon as I finish writing the manual.
Should have been "finding", not "writing" the manual. Wanted to verify the numbers before posting.
Deck height is the distance from the crank centerline to the surface that the head bolts to.
Blueprint calls for a deck height of: 9.330" for the 307/350/403, and 10.625" for the 400/425/455. That changes the external dimensions by about .9" in height, and the same on each side.
Other than the intake manifold and the parts directly related to displacement, everything is the same.
Not the same as BB and SB Chev, where they are actually different and nothing will interchange except the distributor and starter.
Norm.
_________________ Harry S. Truman wrote: When you have an efficient government, you have a dictatorship.
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88 Coupe
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 Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:37 am |
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Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:25 am Posts: 3196 Images: 10 Location: Southern California
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GraveReaper0 wrote: ........ Some specs on the parts? ........ Do you want someone to do the work for you, or do you want to learn how to do it for yourself. GraveReaper0 wrote: ........ Or again, its just not that easy... ?
Do you want to put it on a dyno and get the number, or do you want to put together something you can actually use?
Norm
_________________ Harry S. Truman wrote: When you have an efficient government, you have a dictatorship.
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andrewk
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 Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 11:45 am |
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Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 5:42 pm Posts: 1297 Images: 2 Location: Ames, IA
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88 Coupe wrote: GraveReaper0 wrote: ........ Or again, its just not that easy... ? Do you want to put it on a dyno and get the number, or do you want to put together something you can actually use? Norm
I agree. 350 horses with a 2:43 gear isnt very useful on the street, at least as far as accelleration is concerned, where 200 horses with a 3:73 gear would feel more like 350 horses.
Since you re-registered for ROP, check the engine build section. There are many proven, affordable combos out there that you could copy, or take ideas from. It would be a good idea to post them here too, so we can continue to help. The nice thing is, there are small blocks and big blocks, so you get an idea of what it takes for each to make the kind of power you are looking for.
Hope this helps
Andrew
_________________ Andrew
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GraveReaper0
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 Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 7:26 pm |
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Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:37 pm Posts: 423 Images: 10 Location: Windy Chicago
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Coupe, I would like to provide the specs myself, but how? Where do I start? What exactly changes in the block that makes it put out more horsepower?
Andrew, I already have a turbo 350 trans and 4:11 gears on it.
Coupe, I would like to put it on a dyno and see what the results are, but screw that, I'm going for a build where I can save a few dollars. So I am looking for a daily driver 350 that'll still pull the car into at least 13's on the 1/4 mile. I'll fork out about $3500 for the build, and the swap is gonna cost me $700.
On another note, my friend is selling a set of Impala rims, so I started thinking about how they would look on the Cutlass. But is the bolt pattern same on Chevy and Olds?
I really like this build:
http://72.22.90.30/phpBB2/viewtopic.php ... hlight=350
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andrewk
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 Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 8:10 pm |
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Looks like a decent build. AFAIK, Jim has been running that for awhile with no problems.
Engines are air pumps. The more air you get them to pump, the more power you make. However you want it [the air] to flow as fast as possible. The more fuel/air mix you can get the engine to burn effectively, the more horsepower you make. Makes sense, right?
There are many ways to accomplish this, but the best way is in balance. You want all the components to work together (just like how you want to pick the right cam). I am not very good at this sort of thing, I simply dont have the engine building experience to give advice I am comfortable giving. I'll leave that to someone more experienced than I.
However, I know with your gear- 13s should be cake.
Andrew
_________________ Andrew
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Mark Twain wrote: A man's character may be learned from the adjectives which he habitually uses in conversation.
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88 Coupe
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 Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:27 am |
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Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2004 3:25 am Posts: 3196 Images: 10 Location: Southern California
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GraveReaper0 wrote: I would like to provide the specs myself, but how? Where do I start? …….. Haven’t you already started? Haven’t you been collecting pieces of the puzzle? Keep asking questions about anything you do not understand. It will become clearer as you start seeing how they go together. GraveReaper0 wrote: ........ What exactly changes in the block that makes it put out more horsepower? …….. The block itself? Nothing. Power increases come from the combination of parts inside and on it. GraveReaper0 wrote: …….. and 4:11 gears on it …….. I missed it also. What size tires are on it now? GraveReaper0 wrote: …….. where I can save a few dollars …….. Biggest savings come from not buying parts you don't need. GraveReaper0 wrote: …….. So I am looking for a daily driver 350 that'll still pull the car into at least 13's on the 1/4 mile …….. How much inconvenience and extra maintenance/expense can you live with? GraveReaper0 wrote: …….. I'll fork out about $3500 for the build, and the swap is gonna cost me $700 …….. I’m sure, the engine you use will have already been built by the factory. You would be doing a rebuild. GraveReaper0 wrote: …….. But is the bolt pattern same on Chevy and Olds? ......... Impala should be a full size car. If so, no. andrewk wrote: GraveReaper0 wrote: …….. Jim has been running that for awhile with no problems ……..
Cast pistons are cheap and are more than up to the job at that level. Problem is, he had to zero deck and mill the heads to get up to 9:1 CR. Because of that, he had to use adjustable rockers and custom pushrods. I would have used a piston with more compression height.
Aftermarket distributor is not needed at that level.
Ram air starts adding power at about 60 MPH.
Cam is better suited to a Nitrous/blower application.
26" tire/3.42 gears = 3100+ RPM at 70 MPH.
He changes to slicks and retards timing 2° in order to use the N²O.
Norm
_________________ Harry S. Truman wrote: When you have an efficient government, you have a dictatorship.
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GraveReaper0
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 Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 4:29 am |
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Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:37 pm Posts: 423 Images: 10 Location: Windy Chicago
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Ok strange setup. What about this?
http://72.22.90.30/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18118
Gas friendly and has more torque then I wanted. Its hooking up to a 350 tranny which I got, and almost same size gears. I've got a good feeling about this one.
And I can order the cometic? gasket to get more horses outta it.
Coupe what kind of inconveniences are we talking about? And I can live with above average maintenance. Might even learn a thing or two.
he rear tires are BFG Radial TA's 295/50R15
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andrewk
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 Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 12:00 pm |
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Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 5:42 pm Posts: 1297 Images: 2 Location: Ames, IA
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GraveReaper0 wrote: Ok strange setup. What about this? http://72.22.90.30/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=18118Gas friendly and has more torque then I wanted. Its hooking up to a 350 tranny which I got, and almost same size gears. I've got a good feeling about this one.  And I can order the cometic? gasket to get more horses outta it. Coupe what kind of inconveniences are we talking about? And I can live with above average maintenance. Might even learn a thing or two. he rear tires are BFG Radial TA's 295/50R15
Looks more like the ticket to me... Hopefully you dont have to machine your crank that much...
Id ditch the 4 corner cooling, and maybe the pertronix. I would like to think that OEM HEI would support that... 4 corner cooling flows coolant out of the drivers rear corner of the intake, to improve coolant flow, although it is much debated. You lose the heater if you do it too, although I guess you could plumb it in...
I have read differing opinions on gapless rings too, but again, I have no experience with them so I cant verify one way or the other.
Yes you can order the cometic head gasket. FCR on ROP usually has a good price on them, so does BTR. There should be a vendor thread over there...
_________________ Andrew
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Mark Twain wrote: A man's character may be learned from the adjectives which he habitually uses in conversation.
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88delta88
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 Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2006 3:50 pm |
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Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2003 5:06 pm Posts: 2415 Images: 40 Location: Canada
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yes, but Im guessing he spent a lot more on billet and appearance than you likely would. Those Head covers look awesome, and expensive!
_________________ "I know that you believe that you understood what you think I said, but I am not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
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